A Chat with Dr. Armstrong Alexis, CARICOM’s Deputy Secretary General

Chadia Mathurin: I also think that there is need for education education. And I’m sharing this against the backdrop of an experience. I launched a natural skin care brand here in Ghana last year using shea butter, and the product is a hit back home but… First, I have a Ghanaian business partner and when we started to send products back home [the Caribbean] she was shocked. She had been sending them out to Canada, the US, Europe. And this reaction is not unique to her. The reality is that many Africans do not see the Caribbean as a viable market. And I tell them, “Listen, there is money in the Caribbean”. There is money in the Caribbean. The demand was such that we could not meet it. But also, the logistics, took a toll on us. Nonetheless, just me conducting this little experiment with the skin care line has made it abundantly clear that there is room for us to trade with the continent and vice versa, and it will be profitable if we can sort some things out.

Recently, I came across a news article. I don’t know if you’ve heard of Zeepay. It’s owned by a Ghanaian entrepreneur who’s now gone and implemented/expanded in Barbados. It’s a fintech. A friend of mine sent me the article, where the Founder stated that his aim is to “become the number one remittance-to-wallet player in the region.” Imagine that. An entrepreneur from Ghana has come into the market and has decided that he wants to become the premiere provider of remittance transfers in the Caribbean.

Dr. Armstrong Alexis: Yes because he understands the value of the market.

Chadia Mathurin: Yes. And he has a foothold in the market already because he’s serving a lot of the African continent and Barbados has opened the door to him, so he’s now talking about dominating the Caribbean market. If I am to be honest, I don’t quite know how I feel about that just yet. I’m for co-operation but I don’t know how I feel about an African entity dominating the Caribbean market when many Caribbean entrepreneurs have been struggling to do the same in the region. It made me very uneasy. But that’s the state that we are at, and relations between the continent and the region are definitely beginning to develop. And that’s a plus.

But back to that, there is often the perception in the Caribbean region that the African continent is so poor and backward. But as it concerns the continent’s technological advancements, it is my opinion that they are far ahead of us. And the reality is that if they put their foot in the region, we, Caribbean entrepreneurs, are finished. That’s it.

Dr. Armstrong Alexis: Of course. They are used to dealing with quantity. I remember when I worked in Nigeria I told someone, “It’s not impossible that a Nigerian sells popsicles and in a year he’s a millionaire”. Because while you will be selling popsicles in Laborie you can only sell a hundred a day, those guys will sell a million a day, because they have a large population. So first of all their [Africans] entrepreneurial skills have been developed in a pretty robust and sophisticated manner because they have to deal with all levels, they have large enough markets so they understand quantity, [and] they understand logistics in a way that we probably don’t. If those guys come into the Caribbean with that kind of experience, you’re right, we’re done.

Chadia Mathurin: And they have scale on their side so it’s cheaper for them [ than it is for Caribbean entrepreneurs] to produce per unit.

I prefer to know that the Indigenous Caribbean private sector is able to partner with and learn from experienced African companies rather than the current dispensation of foreign dominance of so many commercial sectors in Saint Lucia and elsewhere in the region.

Chadia Mathurin: I agree.

Dr. Armstrong Alexis: But I’m saying we need to step up to the plate. And how do we step up to the plate? WE step up to the plate by exposing our entrepreneurs , exposing our creatives, not to more of the same; not to more of the North America, not to more of the United Kingdom and Europe. We can get our entrepreneurs to step up to the plate by exposing them to what is happening on the African continent because the perception, like you said, that the African continent have [has] nothing to teach us; they poor, nobody want to be called African because if you call me African is because you telling me that I’m starving or something like that, without recognizing that yes, the continent has its challenges but there are some advancements there that are decades ahead of us in the Caribbean.

Chadia Mathurin: Mobile money.

Dr. Armstrong Alexis: Decades. Decades ahead. I mean when I tell the people, right, that I spent two years in Namibia, I never entered a bank, so this thing about driving through traffic to go and cash a check or go and withdraw money… I paid my electricity on my phone, I paid my bills on my phone, I paid my rent on my phone. [laughs]

Chadia Mathurin: It’s the two of us.

Dr. Armstrong Alexis: All I needed was a phone.

Chadia Mathurin: Exactly. I was telling someone recently, after I blasted a local Saint Lucian bank online, that I don’t know the last time I touched cash in Ghana. I kid you not. I have not touched any cash. [laughs] I go and through mobile money.

Dr. Armstrong Alexis: And you go to market and all kind of thing, right?

Chadia Mathurin: Yes. Even if someone has a “yam” [the name used to describe phones restricted to Global System for Mobile Communications (GSM) protocol, in Ghana], mobile money transactions are still possible. These phones facilitate mobile money transfers through USSD codes. So, we eh [are not] ready yet..

Dr. Armstrong Alexis: A seamstress made some stuff for me. When I was going home I wanted to get my son some African shirts and I went to a seamstress. She made it. But I went to pick it up the day before I traveled. I did not walk with enough cash. She say [says], “You have mobile money?” I said, “I not even sure because I doh [don’t] really use…” She say, “Yes, yes, yes you can do it. You can pay me on my phone.” She gave me her number, I went through the stuff [process] and all I heard on her phone, I just heard Ping! She said, “I got it”. [laughs]. I went back home, I said “Gail, this is just a little seamstress down the road, you know.” This is no big establishment and I was able to pay the woman on mobile money; on the phone. If that was Saint Lucia you have to go and drive to get to the ATM, when you reach dere [there] the ATM not working, you have to drive to another one. By the time you finish you burn endless gas already, you pollute the atmosphere, you sweating, you frustrated. [laughs]. There is so much we can learn from the African continent. But the first thing we need to do is open up our minds to understand that what we think of Africa is not what Africa is. So that mental shift… But again, mental shifts don’t happen without exposure; without knowledge, [and] without experience. So it’s not a straight line and it doesn’t have a particular start point and a particular end point. You have to find ways and means of doing it, and the more we expose ourselves to the continent, the better for us.

So if our institutions start with exposing ourselves to trade fairs, if we start by exposing African artists to CARIFESTA, [and] we also attend some of their festivals so we get an opportunity [to] create that fusion [and] opportunities for engagement. And it will happen overtime. Let’s begin to broadcast each other’s content. So you’re doing Wakonté, for example, I mean that needs to begin to find its way into some structure so that not just a small cohort of people is aware of what is happening but it becomes part of fabric. That is how we are going to change that. Use guys like Tahj Weekes who is trying to do his “Hands Across Africa” and stuff. You know, I told Gail from next year – we’re already planning our holiday – our holiday will be on the African continent. How many Caribbean people will tell you that they’re planning their next holiday and it’s [in] Africa. Their next holiday is England, Canada, US, New York. [chuckles]

Chadia Mathurin: But I think we’re beginning to open the eyes of many people. A lot more Saint Lucians are beginning to come over to the continent. So I think – it’s a few of us but – we’re doing a fairly good job of exposing the continent to the Caribbean.

Interesting Things

Chadia Mathurin: So now I just want to be very chill. Who’s on your playlist right now?

Dr. Armstrong Alexis: Oh my God, I don’t listen to music. My playlist. [laughs] Seriously my playlist used to be Duane Stephenson. I haven’t listened to music in a while. If I were to say right now, right now it would probably have to be Beres Hammond.

Chadia Mathurin: Okay. Not bad. You have decent taste in music. So you’re a bit of a dapper don – that’s what the young ones would call you, right. What are three things that you feel like you absolutely need to have in your wardrobe.

Dr. Armstrong Alexis: I must have for work, definitely I must have ties and a jacket. I must have, a nice, long-sleeved colorful shirt and I must have the most beautiful shorts and proper slippers.

Chadia Mathurin: Okay. We’ll add that extra one for you. And so my final question for you is, what are some of your hobbies?

Dr. Armstrong Alexis: Diving. I’m a scuba diver. I love to go under. So that’s one of my hobbies. The second one is a bit of a hobby but lifestyle; the gym. I love the gym. I love to just go and work out. Thirdly, reading on social and political events.

Chadia Mathurin: So Dr. Alexis, thank you for your time. I really appreciate it. I feel like this was a really cool interview. I learnt a lot – for sure – about CARICOM and a bit of its workings. So I definitely enjoyed the interview. I hope it was as enjoyable for you as it was for me, or even if it wasn’t on the same level at least it was enjoyable.

Dr. Armstrong Alexis: Yes, it was.

Chadia Mathurin: Glad to hear. And again, thank you for doing this.

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